这是马清运提出Eco Power想法的论坛，即Ecology and Economy，刘宇杨译为生态和生计。我主要谈了我们的《一油两用》项目和它要质疑的大政权小市场，或小政权大市场这两种现存的两极世界里生态发展的困境，Raoul Bunschoten 和Michael Keith 分别回应了需要重新定义新世纪建筑师的责任和工作方法，同时呼唤一种不同于上述两级世界的其他的，复合多元的政经制度的探索。讨论时间和内容很多，我无法一一记录。好在应该是《上海科技报》在全程记录谈话，希望到时候可以有全文。

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